Bullying

I think everyone with a problems needs to be helped and they are allowed to be given second, third, fourth chances...

Then again, if I told you I believe sex offenders and prostitutes should be given help just like some insecure high school bully I'd no doubt be raged upon by the right wing brigade for my unabashed liberalism.

Bloodraine:

I think everyone with a problems needs to be helped and they are allowed to be given second, third, fourth chances...

Then again, if I told you I believe sex offenders and prostitutes should be given help just like some insecure high school bully I'd no doubt be raged upon by the right wing brigade for my unabashed liberalism.

well, everyone is completely ignorant and crude when it comes to bullying, at least sex offenders and prostitutes have one wing (personally, I think they should all be given help, but I believe men should be neutered for rape...what wing am I now?

spill_no_sick:

Bloodraine:

I think everyone with a problems needs to be helped and they are allowed to be given second, third, fourth chances...

Then again, if I told you I believe sex offenders and prostitutes should be given help just like some insecure high school bully I'd no doubt be raged upon by the right wing brigade for my unabashed liberalism.

well, everyone is completely ignorant and crude when it comes to bullying, at least sex offenders and prostitutes have one wing (personally, I think they should all be given help, but I believe men should be neutered for rape...what wing am I now?

Sex offenders don't often want to offend. They do it because they themselves were once abused. Some sex offenders want to be castrated (and, chemical castration is not nearly as barbaric as it sounds...it doesn't involve chopping off cock, but removing the glads which cause sexual drive and desire). So in a perverse way, it is helping them..

Thats off topic though.

Bloodraine:

spill_no_sick:

Bloodraine:

I think everyone with a problems needs to be helped and they are allowed to be given second, third, fourth chances...

Then again, if I told you I believe sex offenders and prostitutes should be given help just like some insecure high school bully I'd no doubt be raged upon by the right wing brigade for my unabashed liberalism.

well, everyone is completely ignorant and crude when it comes to bullying, at least sex offenders and prostitutes have one wing (personally, I think they should all be given help, but I believe men should be neutered for rape...what wing am I now?

Sex offenders don't often want to offend. They do it because they themselves were once abused. Some sex offenders want to be castrated (and, chemical castration is not nearly as barbaric as it sounds...it doesn't involve chopping off cock, but removing the glads which cause sexual drive and desire). So in a perverse way, it is helping them..

Thats off topic though.

just a tad, I'm still insanely pissed off at these people
I can't really classify what "wing" I'm part of (c'mon, the French made it up, I'm not going to cooperate with it) but I should think this board is very liberal and hearing these people....Rush Limbaugh would call them close-minded alright
they're worse than the uberconservative

in my opinion, if you aren't open about this, my respect for you here is the same as my respect for the "Christians" who protest funerals

Seriously.
You've made me think here.
My school is hypersensetive about bullying (hell... even i've been done for it, but thats a weird story anyway so ) but all they do is punish the bullies so hard.
I won't lie, they're really harsh about it.
Maybe we should do more to help people. Most likely, they have their own shit going on and they need help much as the victim does.

I know
no one tries to understand anyone, and it feeds probably my earliest philosophy: all problems of humankind is due to lack of communication (which also feeds into my philosophy that humans are the dumbest animals since we've done the worst with what we have but different story...)

everyone on this planet knows that there is a problem
the problem is that everyone wants to (needs to) be heard, but we don't know why

the problem isn't that we aren't speaking
the problem is that we aren't listening
everyone talks, and no one listens, and we as a race only know how to do one of the two at once because we are sheep when it comes to solving issues (and we are parrots when it comes to indentifying them

First off, you are acting as if all bullies are totally innocent in their actions, and thats completely false. So, murders may also have issues, they killed someone, but lets not send them to jail, lets try and help them, forget about serving justice for their victims Thats ridiculous, they still deserve punishment, don't they? Yes. Punishment is helping them to see that all actions have consequences. Now, I do agree with Meg that everyone deserves second chances, but that doesn't mean they don't need punishment. Bullies are guilty of what they do. They tourment others and make their lives hell, anyone who gets pleasure out of that deserves punishment. Without a consequence for a bad action, the action will continue to be commited.

Secondly, Im also not sure where you got this "everyone" from, because all of the posts on the previous page weren't even the same opinion. Several pages back, I made a gigantic post pointing out differnt types of bullies, and why they do certain things. Bullies don't always have the greatest life, more often then not they are extremely insecure about themselves and can have a terrible family life at home (as I stated on the previous page) but does that justify the things they do? Of course not. Punishing them is in fact helping them, The consequence shows them that they have done wrong.

However that isn't always enough. Im in no way saying the victim is any less important than they bully, but offering the bully help can prevent future bullying issues as well. They deserve all punishments they get, but I also think if the issue is severe, other things should be looked into as well. Certain personaility disorders can result in bully-type behavior, but thats still no excuse. They need therapy to learn how to get over their ways, so that others don't have to suffer on their account.

they are certainly not completely innocent, but Michael Jackson isn't innocent in his actions
look at how much being aggressively accusingly oppressive we are of him
we should get him help, not yell, "ew, what a fucking sicko let's lock that asshole up"

it's, "this guy needs help, let's get him help"

I'm not sayign bullies are innocent, I'm saying I understand and forgive them though they don't deserve it

and "everybody" would be the last few pages
I do not forgive them as readily as I do bullies (and yes, bullies are the ones who have ruined my life, I have scars on my wrists and a permenantly ruined homeostasis due to pills from two times I thought that there was no repairing what bullies have done.....I repeat: I feel strongly about this issue, so don't think I'm just taking it lightly and saying, "oh, forgive them, it can't have been that bad"

I'm saying, "it is that bad, but I'm searching how to stop it"
we got to the source of the Holocaust: poorly educated people who believe propaganda very readily

we didn't just stop it, we found the source (we've completely ignored hence all of America...but you see where I'm going

the severity of bullying is irrelevant to me, I know just how far it can go, I have friends who aren't here anymore, I shouldn't be here anymore, due to scaring by bullies
but I want to find a cure, not talk about the severity of the symptoms and how horrible it is that this happens (which is also why there is no cure for AIDS, but I don't want to get off topic

so I completely addressed your first line completely regarding the rest of your post

spill_no_sick:

they are certainly not completely innocent, but Michael Jackson isn't innocent in his actions
look at how much being aggressively accusingly oppressive we are of him
we should get him help, not yell, "ew, what a fucking sicko let's lock that asshole up"

it's, "this guy needs help, let's get him help"

I'm not sayign bullies are innocent, I'm saying I understand and forgive them though they don't deserve it

and "everybody" would be the last few pages
I do not forgive them as readily as I do bullies (and yes, bullies are the ones who have ruined my life, I have scars on my wrists and a permenantly ruined homeostasis due to pills from two times I thought that there was no repairing what bullies have done.....I repeat: I feel strongly about this issue, so don't think I'm just taking it lightly and saying, "oh, forgive them, it can't have been that bad"

I'm saying, "it is that bad, but I'm searching how to stop it"
we got to the source of the Holocaust: poorly educated people who believe propaganda very readily

we didn't just stop it, we found the source (we've completely ignored hence all of America...but you see where I'm going

the severity of bullying is irrelevant to me, I know just how far it can go, I have friends who aren't here anymore, I shouldn't be here anymore, due to scaring by bullies
but I want to find a cure, not talk about the severity of the symptoms and how horrible it is that this happens (which is also why there is no cure for AIDS, but I don't want to get off topic

so I completely addressed your first line completely regarding the rest of your post

me:

Im in no way saying the victim is any less important than they bully, but offering the bully help can prevent future bullying issues as well.

I think punishment is part of the cure. Showing a bully their actions have consequences, in some cases is enough to make it stop, however I also said "that isn't always enough." and they need help beyond that. I never meant to imply that you were taking the issue lightly, if I thought that I wouldn't have deemed your posts important enough to respond to, and they were. You made valid points about the lives that bullies can lead, but I felt there were other details that needed to be addressed as well.

in a way, most people don't treat bullying as a real problem. Most adults or people will say "Oh, they're just kidding around", "Boys will be boys and girls will be girls!", and the oh-so-famous "You just need to toughen up". These people who say these types of things are, obviously, ignorant to the problem or are a bully-type themselves. Honestly, from going through so much bullying for so many years (to the point where I had to transfer to a different school), I can tell when someone is intentionally being malicious or kidding through the tone of the voice, the look in their eyes, and just overall, their body language (as body language almost never lies). I believe that these bullies are just as bad as people who torture others, as they torture countless people through words and psychologically and emotionally breaking actions. It just makes me sick when I see a bully being glorified or even when I just see one in general.

spill_no_sick, you're generalising. I don't feel like "Oh, all bullies are bad, and they should be killed" or something. Because I'm want to know why they do things, and what's going on in their heads, because I don't talk as much, I can see what people are thinking better than most people I know. So I do try to be understanding.

And they should be given chances. They should be gotten help. But they should also be punished, because they have to understand, as Courtney said, that what they are doing is wrong, and they have to realise that there are consequences for that.

I know just how far bullies can go as well, all my schooling pretty much up until this year.. that's 11 years of schooling, I was picked on and bullied.

And I try to understand them, and I do to an extent, but, when you're little, and you do something bad, you're punished, so you learn that you shouldn't do that again. The same thing applies, if they're punished, along with getting help or something, then they'll learn that they can't do that again.

I think that bullying depends on the victims too. For example me. I got bullied as a kid. I always had the best grades and the best behavior in class, teachers always liked me so I was the class nerd. Once I got the best grade and this guy said Oh look she always has to know it all. That really hurt me and I cried. I felt bad because he was really mean and since then I was called a geek/nerd everyday. First I felt really awful and I was crying all the time. They didnt hit me or anything, but it was painful cause I was really young. I always thought that having good grades doesnt make me a bad person and I never thought of myself as a nerd. I kept telling that to people, but nobody cared. Later on I decided to have ful confidence in myself (which never happened), but I didnt think of myself as a geek. I accepted the fact of being called that name all the time. When years passed by kids stopped calling me that. One of the reasons was that I turned my "weakness" into something funny. Always when someone asked me to do something bad or to skip school I said that nerds dont do it and it all turned into a joke later. My knowledge of school subjects turned into a something good too. Everyone gain respect for me cause they realized Im not stupid and they dont wanna mess with someone who gives them homework and helps on tests At first I didnt want to be used, but I became friends with those people later. Maybe its because they grown older or cause I didnt want to be treated badly anymore and I changed it.

But not a lot of kids can do the same and we need to help them. Bullies need help as well cause you can punish them, but they can continue with bullying later.

I've been bullied myself and I can tell you; you feel very miserable and sad all day long.
I've cried for 2 and a half hours at the nights.
It's not funny.
In that time it was a really hard time for me. I had troubles on school, trouble at home and with myself. I was struggling with an eating disorder.
They didn't like the way I looked, and they didn't like my boyfriend either. And one of them hung flyers with me as a clown all over the school.. That really wasn't funny!
I'm glad they all learned their lessons. The did apoligize to me. I have other friends now, but I still see those people. They chanced a lot and one of them was become very nice to me.
Because I've been bullied, I am now stronger than before. My eating disorder is gone (I'm glad about that!)
I'm a very stronger person now, at school.

Bullying is a peculiar thing indeed.

I cannot remember a day when I haven't had some snide comment, action or laugh directed squarely at me. But, in my mind it's what I deserved.

I know people always say "just go and tell" but it's not as simple as that. It's like a dirty secret. Sort of. You can't tell because you know somehow it will get worse. Parents don't always offer the support you need either. 'Just hit them back!'.

As if it was that simple.

The first time I cracked with the bullying I wrapped my hands around someone's throat. I was 10. I wanted to see her suffocate. Of course, I didn't.

Bullies need rehabilitation. We just haven't found the right way yet.

I really hate it when people say "Kids have to deal with bullying later on in life, so its better if they face it in school first." The only reason bullying happens later on in life is because it happens in school. And it sucks. But its not like a disease. Bullies need help. Sometimes, its as simple as a talk with the guidance counselor or being confronted by the victim. And sometimes its as serious as a headshrink.

And sometimes it elevates to the level where Colombine-like incidents happen. Point is, it's always going to exist in some tiny sliver. There is no utopia.

lyrical_gaah52:

And sometimes it elevates to the level where Colombine-like incidents happen. Point is, it's always going to exist in some tiny sliver. There is no utopia.

Erm, do you mean THEY were bullies or victims? I need some clarification.

[Joan] Polemic Epidemic:

lyrical_gaah52:

And sometimes it elevates to the level where Colombine-like incidents happen. Point is, it's always going to exist in some tiny sliver. There is no utopia.

Erm, do you mean THEY were bullies or victims? I need some clarification.

I do believe she is referring to the victims.
The victims of being bullied are often driven to seeking revenge, hence Columbine-like incidents.

Coff:

spill_no_sick, you're generalising. I don't feel like "Oh, all bullies are bad, and they should be killed" or something. Because I'm want to know why they do things, and what's going on in their heads, because I don't talk as much, I can see what people are thinking better than most people I know. So I do try to be understanding.

And they should be given chances. They should be gotten help. But they should also be punished, because they have to understand, as Courtney said, that what they are doing is wrong, and they have to realise that there are consequences for that.

I know just how far bullies can go as well, all my schooling pretty much up until this year.. that's 11 years of schooling, I was picked on and bullied.

And I try to understand them, and I do to an extent, but, when you're little, and you do something bad, you're punished, so you learn that you shouldn't do that again. The same thing applies, if they're punished, along with getting help or something, then they'll learn that they can't do that again.

okay, when anyone says "you people" they always mean "every single individual with no exceptions because out of the billions of people on the Earth they are all the same"

I just mean most of the posts on pages 13-14
that was the way the discussion was heading and yes, punishment is necessarry

of course it is
(let's take this out of context for a second...just for clarrification)
if a guy rapes a girl, of course I think he needs to get counsiling
I also think he should go to jail and have his dick chopped off

there should always be punishment, but that just says, "what you do is bad"
it doesn't get them to understand why, it doesn't get to the source of why they do it

punishment prevents it temporarily, which is great
but trying to understand/care/and all of those other words Americans burst into flames when they hear help to prevent it in the long run
(and I mean understand and care for everybody, not just bullies, not just victims, but everyone relevant and irrelevant to anything

spill_no_sick:

okay, when anyone says "you people" they always mean "every single individual with no exceptions because out of the billions of people on the Earth they are all the same"

I just mean most of the posts on pages 13-14
that was the way the discussion was heading and yes, punishment is necessarry

of course it is
(let's take this out of context for a second...just for clarrification)
if a guy rapes a girl, of course I think he needs to get counsiling
I also think he should go to jail and have his dick chopped off

there should always be punishment, but that just says, "what you do is bad"
it doesn't get them to understand why, it doesn't get to the source of why they do it

punishment prevents it temporarily, which is great
but trying to understand/care/and all of those other words Americans burst into flames when they hear help to prevent it in the long run
(and I mean understand and care for everybody, not just bullies, not just victims, but everyone relevant and irrelevant to anything

To the first part; well iunno, thats the way I've always taken it, and everyone I know has always taken it. So yeah. Misunderstanding =]

Yeah, I agree with the help/councelling thing. Because they do have to realise it is bad, but they also have to understand why it was bad. So yeah, they should be both punished and councelled.

I need a bit of help with standing up to bullies. My friends and I are sorta the outcast with would seem. I just wish I had a little more guts. That way I could tell them off. But I'm scared.

Is there anyway for me to think without being scared? Some days I don't give a shit butt then others I do.

I know if I said anything their friends would harass me too. But I can't ignore that shit. I really would like help.