Independance
| Author | Message |
|---|---|
| schooldropout Banned  Age: 35 Gender: Male Posts: 88  | I'm all for Scotlands independence. |
| a-dawg. Falling In Love With The Board  Age: 31 Gender: Female Posts: 7070 | Anji:All I'm saying is that I think NI should be rejoined with the South. |
| Bones Falling In Love With The Board  Age: 36 Gender: Female Posts: 5734  | Anji: We only have limited freedom - we cant make all decisions that effect Scotland on our own -we need english approval. And plus the powers we have just now we only have because the english allowed us to have them. it such a hard thing to explain if you dont feel it - I want indendance thats all I can really say and not being conservative has nothing to do with it - im not anything, I just feel how i feel on a whole range of issues and on this one I just feel that the right thing is an independant Scotland. As much as it's true that I am legally british it doesnt make me want to be and make me feel that its right. |
| Anji Basket Case  Age: 35 Gender: Female Posts: 15914 | Conservativeness has everything to do with it. Paleo-conservatism is a sense of belonging and identity. People are trying to get rid of that, i.e. you. It's what the title of it suggest, conservation, preservation of your past. And this is not something that I could not understand, I'm pretty much a doormat when it comes to people pressing my with beliefs, I admit, but so far it is something I fail to understand simply because I don't see a point. I just hear all these people talking about independence, but nothing about why. |
| Bones Falling In Love With The Board Age: 36 Gender: Female Posts: 5734 | Anji:the why is simply just because we want it and i think it's the opposite, Im not trying to get rid of this paleo-conservatism thingy If what it is is a sense of belonging and identity then its the very thing that I'm standing up for - to me and others who want independance thats exactly why- we want to belong and have an our identity as Scottish - not brittish, scottish |
| a-dawg. Falling In Love With The Board Age: 31 Gender: Female Posts: 7070 | Anji:Well, for me it's partly just because it's the way I was brought up. I'm from a family with IRA roots (old IRA, I stress, years ago, and I'm not pro-IRA, I'm pro-Republican). I come from a roughish area in Dublin where everyone's Republican. Also, I've never understood why the English had to invade. Why bloody everyone had to invade. Why they fought so hard to keep it once they had. Also, it's what I've been taught. In our curriculum we focus mostly on Irish history and they illustrate all of the atrocities (on both sides, but before the early 20th century/late 19th it was mostly the English committing atrocities). Oh and in Ireland, it's kinda an instilled thing. Like our national anthem is all about war, basically. And kids often read historical novels from an early age, and some of them show how terrible the English were back then. And even recently, (and of course, the IRA have done really, really terrible things that most Irish people would never condone) there have been cases like the Guildford Four and the Birmingham Six, and Bobby Sands, and the Bloody Sunday incidents, etc. |
| Anji Basket Case Age: 35 Gender: Female Posts: 15914 | I understand the Irish, but not the Scottish. I was partly raised by a man who had been through the worst of the IRA and knows their beliefs and history and members from back to front. I understand a lot of it. He's told me all about what it was like to be raised in Ireland during the 'turmoil' or whatever. Just to me, the Scots are far, far away from building any sort of case against being part of the Union which Ireland had. |
| Anji Basket Case Age: 35 Gender: Female Posts: 15914 | Elegant Rubble:Being British doesn't make you any less Scottish and vice versa. If you don't give a wank about Britain, fine, be Scottish on your own terms. You are way more free than you think. Nobody is stopping you from dressing from head to toe in navy blue with white crosses, if you think that'll be the difference after being liberated. How are you opressed, please tell me, I want to know. I don't know how many times I've said it, but I'm going to ask you again. |
| Bones Falling In Love With The Board Age: 36 Gender: Female Posts: 5734 | Anji: And I'm going to tell you again that the scottish parliment does not have full control over scotland. Its not personal freedom - its political freedom, there are some things that effect scotland that ultimely we dont have a say in. Sure we have reps down in london but their outnumbered therefore outvoted by english who are only considering england! Like the north sea oil - westminister wont give us devolution in it, they say it'll coz instability, and maybe it just me being my usual cynical self but i agree with Alec Salmond and tommy sherredon, they just dont want to lose any of the profit!!! I never said we were oppresed, i said we dont have full freedom, and i dont know how many times i have to tell you its that our government isn limited to only powers england will let us have. Everything should be under scottish control and scottish control only! And being british does make me less scottish - it makes part of my identy, at least to the outside world part of the union. My passport says that im british therefor I'm recognised as britsh not scottish, therfore less scottish. When i lived in canda most people actually thought that scotland was a part of england, they were so clueless, and thats not the first place ive been where thats been standard thought, as a scot that really pisses me off. The only way for us to be truelly recognised as a country in our own right is to be independant - a "self determining people" status is no longer good enough for me. |
| Plug In Baby. Addict Age: 34 Gender: Female Posts: 11334 | Elegant Rubble: Did communism work out? Elegant Rubble: No no no no no. No no no. I'm sorry, but how could you not know about the situation in Ireland and Northern Ireland? How could you wish that, for selfish reasons? There are so many issues surrounding it, it's kind of a sticky situation. Wikipedia it, or something! |
| Bones Falling In Love With The Board Age: 36 Gender: Female Posts: 5734 | Plug In Baby.: it did actually in the end, lots of communnist countries are republics now. And plus theres no fear of scotland becoming a communist country - this situation would work out, all do in the end. And i didnt say i didnt know about the situation i N Ireland, I said i dont know enough to say whether it would be better to stay part of the UK or to become part of the republic And I could quite easily wish that for selfish reasons, thats what selfish people do, think about themselves in any situation - i want independance and N Ireland breaking away from the Uk would provide that oppertunity for us to do so, therefore to me that would be beneficial. |
| The Doctor Falling In Love With The Board  Age: 35 Gender: Female Posts: 8786 | Elegant Rubble: Oh yeah, totally worked out. Those countries are now the poorest countries in Europe and Russia is run by Mafia law. Any of that ring a bell? Since when did a well thought out country have most of it's girls being enticed into sex slavery in the UK and other places? |
| NeoSteph Basket Case  Age: 37 Gender: Female Posts: 16494 | for scotland to become an independant state would bankrupt Britain. it would cost billions to change the structure of parliament and for the love of god if its not broke don't fix it. Scotland has MP's like the rest of the nation they also have a seperate parliament on top of that so they are more than equally represented. The ironic thing about Scotland wanting to be independant is that they can't do it on their own. Maybe if the scottish built up their economic power they would be able to branch out without the rotten english's help, but thats not the case. simply put, Scotland you have two options continue to be part of one of the riches nations in the world or seperate causeing both yourself an dthe rest of Britian to crash in the markets and to lead yourself into peril. You have freedom you are not oppressed and i find it laughable that you don't think that Scotland is represented, have you heard Gordon Browns accent lately. |
| Bones Falling In Love With The Board Age: 36 Gender: Female Posts: 5734 | yeah but gordon brown is a prick we didnt vote for him, nor would we if he ran in scotland for first minister and scotland has oil that generates billions, i dont care if the rest of britain went bankrupt and those communist countries i quite frankly dont care about either. In life things work out, situations resolve themselves just because these countries are in that state now doesnt mean that they always will, if scotland became independant all the other issues would be worked out. This isnt a communisim topic so drop it, start your own thread if you care that much about it cause i dont. and whatever, I still want independance, always will |
| Matt Smith Admin  Age: 33 Gender: Female Posts: 31134 | Elegant Rubble: So you assume that everyone who is pro-scottish independance is a good person? |
| NeoSteph Basket Case Age: 37 Gender: Female Posts: 16494 | Elegant Rubble: Scotland does not own the oil they have no right to it, it belongs to those very rich oil companys who just happen to dig for oil in scotland. Plus setting up an independant state and wanting it to reach success would take decades, the one thing you seem to think would achieve economic success would be dried up in this part of the world by then. You have a narrowminded view if you think things like that work out. Small countries are only successful when they are a part of a larger nation. The EU for example, that brings on to my second question you want independance from Britian would you want it from the EU seeing as that would still link you to britan and inabout 10 years its going to be one giant superstate anyway. |
| The Doctor Falling In Love With The Board Age: 35 Gender: Female Posts: 8786 | Elegant Rubble:But, y'see, you can't drop it. I am discussing an example of 'freedom'. Perhaps you should have studied Modern Studies. You would understand that in the real world, things don't just fall into place or get worked out. If Gordon Brown said that 'Oh, let's just vacate Iraq. It'll all work out.', you and a lot of other people (including myself) would kick up a fuss because it would be an infantile and frankly thick move. Again, examples! Another example; back in 1914, they all figured that the war would 'all be over by Christmas'. What happened? Tradegy beyond tradegy. So tragic that you think of the worst tradagy and add another suitcase of tradegy. You can never, ever merely assume that everything will work out because things rarely ever do. There will always be bugs in the system that you need to think apon or they will cause havoc. There is no idea or ideology in the entire existance of the world that has no fault or disbelief tied to it. You can't simply rely solely on oil either. Oil runs out. One day, that oil will go bye-bye. What then? Scotland's income at the moment is dependant on a few things; call centres, oil and fishing. The oil will dry up, the seas are overfished already and call centres are now mainly based in cheap labour countries. I know what you are going to say: "Things will work out. They won't be like that forever." But will they be worked out in your life-time? You should care about other countries because, yes Scotland can be independant from the UK but it cannot be independant from the world. You should never say that you don't give a toss about other countries because you never know when something will come up that you need help with. |
| Bones Falling In Love With The Board Age: 36 Gender: Female Posts: 5734 | I really dont care if they work out in my life time, I's still rather be independant and there are plenty of small countries that are more than able to stand on their, like Denmark, Scotland would be fine. And the money generated from the oil would be enough to get as on our feet - I know it runs out but it will tide us over till we develop other industries. And I know i should care about other countries but that doesnt mean that I do. There's plenty of things I should care about that I just dont. And I dont care about that either. And if nothing ever works out perfectly then what does it matter if Scotland becomes independant, we'd be fine, we have problems now, issues that could be resolved with independance so what difference will make having new problems if we're ok enough just now we'll be ok enough then. |
| Bones Falling In Love With The Board Age: 36 Gender: Female Posts: 5734 | Bloodraine: no i dont. I'm pro-independance but i wouldn't go as far as saying I was a good person just because there are pricks on the pro side doesnt make gordon brown any less of a prick |
| Bones Falling In Love With The Board Age: 36 Gender: Female Posts: 5734 | and plus gordon brown is only one man who has become completely anglosised so therefor does not represent scotland he represents the UK so only partly represents scotland, we need someone who will fully recognise scotland so that our needs and views that most times completey oppose england's are met and seen in the world areana A first minister is a start but that's all it is, a start you should listen to tommy sherredon - he explains this way better than I can o and guess what people, I still want independance |
Of course they do, that doesn't mean that they aren't however. Their passports specifically say so.Options
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