An Evil God?

Nine_Inch_Nails:

NeoSteph:

Nine_Inch_Nails:

NeoSteph:

Nine_Inch_Nails:

But if God didn't exist, then some people's lives would basically have been based on lies, and that's a bit..meh.

"If God is evil, why would he create us, and give us a beautiful earth to inhabit, and the greatest gift of all, Life?."

And why did he give us the abililty to ruin it all.
Why did he give us freewill?
Didn't he realise we'd just fuck it up.
If he is "all-knowing", then shoudln't he have know that.
Why did he create murderers.
If he's the only one who is supposed to be able to give or take life, then why are murderers still here? They don't deserve free will.

You aren't born a murderer, society shapes you to be that way.

How do you know that?

Because when i look at a childs face i don't think yep your going to kill someone.

Anyone who kills for drugs/money, is doing it because of their situation

Anyone who kills for 'respect' is because the people they live/hang with have had that affect on them.

Serial Killers are mostly people who were abused by the adults in their life and let down by society, and have been taught through this that violence is how you deal with problems

Anyone who murders in war does it because thats whats expected of them and what they have been trained to do.

But God made society. Everyone who kills has been affected by their situation...well who made their situation like that? Who made their parent's abuse them? What made their parent's abuse them? And if their parent's parent's abused THEM, then who made them like that etc etc? If we all came from Adam and Eve, and we are all related, then maybe, we've all like...fucked up each other.
But Adam and Eve came from God.
If God IS all powerful...coudln't he fix everything at once?

But saying that, perfection is impossible.

"Imperfection is beautiful, that is why you are so beautiful"

would you want to be independant or woud you want it all fixed?

Adam and Eve rejected God's presense when they ate the fruit from the tree.

NeoSteph:

Bloodraine:

Nine_Inch_Nails:

tre_cool_is_god:

if he did exsist would he tempt us the way he does?

Ah, but a Christian believes that Satan is the tempation
Not God.

God created Satan, though...How does that pan out, as he is indirectly responsible?

God created Angels with the same free-will of humans, Satan choose to take a different route, however angels being in god presense have to directly deal with god there and then, which is why he was rejected from heaven...

Wouldn't that be Satan as Lucifer though?
I don't believe in Satan. I do believe in Lucifer however. And I don't believe he was rejected from...Side (my version of heaven and hell combined, basically limbo, I'm not explaining it now, it would take ages lol) and the Gods and Goddesses, I believe he left himself. I don't believe he was evil. Plus 1/3 of the other angels followed him. Does that not maybe suggest something about them not being happy with the way heaven was being "run"? (if I was looking at it from a Christian point of view)

For argument's sake, lets just say there is a God, for certain. If God is evil, why would he create us, and give us a beautiful earth to inhabit, and the greatest gift of all, Life?.


ok maybe he gave us a nice beautiful earth because he knew that in the end we would destroy it and die a long and horrible death in all the fumes of the horrible technogical shit WE made. i personally dont believe he is real. he is supposed to be good...well in the stereo typical idea of him any way. (asuming its a he) but how can so many people suffer so much and others just be happy? and the whole creation story is a load of bull shit (in my opinion) because how could one man (and where the fuck did he come from) make all this shit? and then there is the argument that satan is the evil but then would god not have created him? or prehaps its the other way around. who is to say? all i know is that i dont believe in him, i believe that the world is seemless, the earth is there animals and humans inhabite it, maybe say girrafes take over first time and blow the world up causing the next world to occur, and maybe cats take over but they too fail and blow the world up causing the next world to occur, and say that world is our world and we build it up and seperate the people and degrade each other and maybe we wont end up blowing the world up (maybe it will happen of its own accord when we fail) maybe we kill each other, like no one left, maybe it is contiual until some thing (maybe even trees) succeds and creats a perfect world. but who the fucks knows thats just a girl whos fucked out of her brains ideas!

NeoSteph:

Nine_Inch_Nails:

NeoSteph:

Nine_Inch_Nails:

NeoSteph:

Nine_Inch_Nails:

But if God didn't exist, then some people's lives would basically have been based on lies, and that's a bit..meh.

"If God is evil, why would he create us, and give us a beautiful earth to inhabit, and the greatest gift of all, Life?."

And why did he give us the abililty to ruin it all.
Why did he give us freewill?
Didn't he realise we'd just fuck it up.
If he is "all-knowing", then shoudln't he have know that.
Why did he create murderers.
If he's the only one who is supposed to be able to give or take life, then why are murderers still here? They don't deserve free will.

You aren't born a murderer, society shapes you to be that way.

How do you know that?

Because when i look at a childs face i don't think yep your going to kill someone.

Anyone who kills for drugs/money, is doing it because of their situation

Anyone who kills for 'respect' is because the people they live/hang with have had that affect on them.

Serial Killers are mostly people who were abused by the adults in their life and let down by society, and have been taught through this that violence is how you deal with problems

Anyone who murders in war does it because thats whats expected of them and what they have been trained to do.

But God made society. Everyone who kills has been affected by their situation...well who made their situation like that? Who made their parent's abuse them? What made their parent's abuse them? And if their parent's parent's abused THEM, then who made them like that etc etc? If we all came from Adam and Eve, and we are all related, then maybe, we've all like...fucked up each other.
But Adam and Eve came from God.
If God IS all powerful...coudln't he fix everything at once?

But saying that, perfection is impossible.

"Imperfection is beautiful, that is why you are so beautiful"

would you want to be independant or woud you want it all fixed?

Adam and Eve rejected God's presense when they ate the fruit from the tree.

I'd want to be independant. But I'm saying he could do it if he wanted, he could get rid of war etc.

If I was a LaVeyan Satanist, I would believe that people were the root of all good and evil.
What I want to know, is why, and HOW people like Hitler, Stalin etc came to live. What possesed them.

OMG I'm confusing myself so much, lots of random points keep coming into my head, so i'm forgetting them, then remembering them halfway through a sentence and so on, so I'm sorry if my replies don't make much sense lol.

And I always noticed that it was Eve who first became tempted by the fruit, which is a suggestion towards the weakness of women. This is one of the reasons I believe the world became a patriarchal society. I think it all stemmed from that. If God wanted equality etc, then is there rasicm etc?
What did Lucifer want? Equality. That is what he truely wanted. Which, I believe, is the reason he left Side (or Heaven).

In this respect, I could class Lucifer as the lesser evil here.

Nine_Inch_Nails:

NeoSteph:

Bloodraine:

Nine_Inch_Nails:

tre_cool_is_god:

if he did exsist would he tempt us the way he does?

Ah, but a Christian believes that Satan is the tempation
Not God.

God created Satan, though...How does that pan out, as he is indirectly responsible?

God created Angels with the same free-will of humans, Satan choose to take a different route, however angels being in god presense have to directly deal with god there and then, which is why he was rejected from heaven...

Wouldn't that be Satan as Lucifer though?
I don't believe in Satan. I do believe in Lucifer however. And I don't believe he was rejected from...Side (my version of heaven and hell combined, basically limbo, I'm not explaining it now, it would take ages lol) and the Gods and Goddesses, I believe he left himself. I don't believe he was evil. Plus 1/3 of the other angels followed him. Does that not maybe suggest something about them not being happy with the way heaven was being "run"? (if I was looking at it from a Christian point of view)

I had the name Azrael in my head, but thats a different angel

Well thats where are faiths seperate, i do believe there was a great divide within heaven, what I believe is there was agreat war and God rejected those who fought against him, and thats where the term demons come from.

I guess from an Angel perspective, i would be a bit pissed off that an entire new species had been created and had been given free-will to do what they wished and they had been created to serve. So what I believe is that Lucifer wanted the same rights as humans.

however i don't think that makes god evil, God was learning as he went how to be a superior being, he was a bit of a wanker in the old testament but relaxed in the new (thats a terrible way of putting it but i couldn't think of another way of putting it )

NeoSteph:

Nine_Inch_Nails:

NeoSteph:

Bloodraine:

Nine_Inch_Nails:

tre_cool_is_god:

if he did exsist would he tempt us the way he does?

Ah, but a Christian believes that Satan is the tempation
Not God.

God created Satan, though...How does that pan out, as he is indirectly responsible?

God created Angels with the same free-will of humans, Satan choose to take a different route, however angels being in god presense have to directly deal with god there and then, which is why he was rejected from heaven...

Wouldn't that be Satan as Lucifer though?
I don't believe in Satan. I do believe in Lucifer however. And I don't believe he was rejected from...Side (my version of heaven and hell combined, basically limbo, I'm not explaining it now, it would take ages lol) and the Gods and Goddesses, I believe he left himself. I don't believe he was evil. Plus 1/3 of the other angels followed him. Does that not maybe suggest something about them not being happy with the way heaven was being "run"? (if I was looking at it from a Christian point of view)

I had the name Azrael in my head, but thats a different angel

Well thats where are faiths seperate, i do believe there was a great divide within heaven, what I believe is there was agreat war and God rejected those who fought against him, and thats where the term demons come from.

I guess from an Angel perspective, i would be a bit pissed off that an entire new species had been created and had been given free-will to do what they wished and they had been created to serve. So what I believe is that Lucifer wanted the same rights as humans.

however i don't think that makes god evil, God was learning as he went how to be a superior being, he was a bit of a wanker in the old testament but relaxed in the new (thats a terrible way of putting it but i couldn't think of another way of putting it )

That's a pretty good way of putting.

I mean, if you look at a chapter like Leviticus, in my eyes, that is pure evil
Then if you look at Mark's Gospel, it's a lot more for helping people, and the woman who put her hands on Jesus' coat didn't get condemned, she got helped.

we do live in a very patriarchal society and that will never change, not from lack of trying but because you can't re-write 1000's of years of History.

The will always be strong independant women, but as a gender there are too many hidden forces holding us back ourselves included.

What you have to remember about the writing of the bible is that it was written by the 'pen' and the pen was held by man, if your being blamed for sin you put it onto a creature less 'worthy' than you, in that time it would be women.

NeoSteph:

we do live in a very patriarchal society and that will never change, not from lack of trying but because you can't re-write 1000's of years of History.

The will always be strong independant women, but as a gender there are too many hidden forces holding us back ourselves included.

What you have to remember about the writing of the bible is that it was written by the 'pen' and the pen was held by man, if your being blamed for sin you put it onto a creature less 'worthy' than you, in that time it would be women.

Yep.
And if children were supposed to be clean and innocent, then why was the woman always condemned after childbirth for 7 days, and after menstruation for 7 days and were not allowed in the temple, and on the 8th day they would have to go to the temple and sacrifice an animal.
Yet, sacrificing animals is "supposedly" a Satanic ritual (total bollocks).
And if a man touched her during those 7 days then he would become uncleaned and would have to be ritually cleansed?

And this may be off topic, but why do women always get called whores, yet men don't? It's all stemed from the Old Testament.

Nine_Inch_Nails:

NeoSteph:

we do live in a very patriarchal society and that will never change, not from lack of trying but because you can't re-write 1000's of years of History.

The will always be strong independant women, but as a gender there are too many hidden forces holding us back ourselves included.

What you have to remember about the writing of the bible is that it was written by the 'pen' and the pen was held by man, if your being blamed for sin you put it onto a creature less 'worthy' than you, in that time it would be women.

Yep.
And if children were supposed to be clean and innocent, then why was the woman always condemned after childbirth for 7 days, and after menstruation for 7 days and were not allowed in the temple, and on the 8th day they would have to go to the temple and sacrifice an animal.
Yet, sacrificing animals is "supposedly" a Satanic ritual (total bollocks).
And if a man touched her during those 7 days then he would become uncleaned and would have to be ritually cleansed?

And this may be off topic, but why do women always get called whores, yet men don't? It's all stemed from the Old Testament.

Your supposed to only take the fundamental rules from the old and embrace the New.

It's not just whore, think about mr and mrs. As in as a women you become your mr's

NeoSteph:

Nine_Inch_Nails:

NeoSteph:

we do live in a very patriarchal society and that will never change, not from lack of trying but because you can't re-write 1000's of years of History.

The will always be strong independant women, but as a gender there are too many hidden forces holding us back ourselves included.

What you have to remember about the writing of the bible is that it was written by the 'pen' and the pen was held by man, if your being blamed for sin you put it onto a creature less 'worthy' than you, in that time it would be women.

Yep.
And if children were supposed to be clean and innocent, then why was the woman always condemned after childbirth for 7 days, and after menstruation for 7 days and were not allowed in the temple, and on the 8th day they would have to go to the temple and sacrifice an animal.
Yet, sacrificing animals is "supposedly" a Satanic ritual (total bollocks).
And if a man touched her during those 7 days then he would become uncleaned and would have to be ritually cleansed?

And this may be off topic, but why do women always get called whores, yet men don't? It's all stemed from the Old Testament.

Your supposed to only take the fundamental rules from the old and embrace the New.

It's not just whore, think about mr and mrs. As in as a women you become your mr's

That had never occured to me. And look at all the good names men get - bachelor, sir, master etc. Women get mistress (which always makes me think of affairs), dame, and spinster It's just not on.

"Supposed" to being the opperative word here. Which is why we end up with Christians fundamentalists, but taking it too far. I'd have thought they'd have taken all the nice bits from the Old Testament.
But people such like Jehovas Witnesses just take it all literally, and believe what it says. I'm sorry, but I think Leviticus is somewhat corrupted, and to have people actually believing that, to actually follow that is..well...it disturbs me. Especially since some that I've talked to have gone about Satanic rituals being about sacrificing animals etc, and yet THEY believe that women shoudl have to go through the process of being clean and whatever.
I'm not saying all Christian fundamentalists and Jehovas Witnesses are like that, but the ones I've met are.

The bible can be interpreted in many different ways and because of that God can.

*pauses because funny sketch is on the tv*

The reason his only son was sent to earth was to die for us, people say he's evil for this, but Jesus is God, It was god's way of saying, i know your not perfect but that doesn't matter as long as you have a good heart

And Jesus also said he died for us...

To save mankind.

If he was going to "save" us, doesn't that affect out free will? And how exactly is he going to save us? I think the human race has gone waay too far right now to change.

Nine_Inch_Nails:

And Jesus also said he died for us...

To save mankind.

If he was going to "save" us, doesn't that affect out free will? And how exactly is he going to save us? I think the human race has gone waay too far right now to change.

ah well god works in mysterious ways.

About two years ago, a two year old was in a car crash in which her mother died, she then had to survive 5 days with no water or food in the freezing car, the little girl was called angel.

For some reason that struck, i believe in free-will but i also believe that god has a plan for us, i've had 4 near death experiances so by some force of fate i'm still here.


I don't know how he's going to save us or when only that he will, but then thats faith

Nine_Inch_Nails:

Although, if you go of one of Anton LaVey's quotes.."Good is what you like, evil is what you don't like" then yes, maybe God could be classed as evil. I mean, if you didn't like the Christian God, infact, detested Him, then maybe he is evil to you.

Never thought of it like that. Interesting.

In general good people do good things and bad people do bad things but for good people do do bad things it takes something like God to influence them.
Like the preist who murdered a doctor because he worked at an aportion clinic. He was essentially a good person but he killed in the name of God.

Nine_Inch_Nails:

And Jesus also said he died for us...

To save mankind.

If he was going to "save" us, doesn't that affect out free will? And how exactly is he going to save us? I think the human race has gone waay too far right now to change.

What confuses me about Jesus dying for our sins is not the free will part but...ok, Jesus is part God (holy trinity and all that), so he didn't have to die to save us God could have just forgiven us if he wanted to, he didn't have to send his son to earth to be tortured for the sake of humanity. He's suppose to be the all powerful God, he made the world, he can do what he wants, so...why not just forgive us without the big crucifixion ?

Nine_Inch_Nails:

But God made society. Everyone who kills has been affected by their situation...well who made their situation like that? Who made their parent's abuse them? What made their parent's abuse them? And if their parent's parent's abused THEM, then who made them like that etc etc? If we all came from Adam and Eve, and we are all related, then maybe, we've all like...fucked up each other.
But Adam and Eve came from God.
If God IS all powerful...coudln't he fix everything at once?

But saying that, perfection is impossible.

"Imperfection is beautiful, that is why you are so beautiful"

God made the earth, then poeple who made the earth this way. Like in school this girl asked the "christian" teacher "If God made marijuana why is it illegal?" To which she replied " Yes God did make marijuana, but its people who thought up the smoking part." Like beer :/ Comes from plants right? People invented beer. Thats why its bad I guess.

Incubus:

Nine_Inch_Nails:

And Jesus also said he died for us...

To save mankind.

If he was going to "save" us, doesn't that affect out free will? And how exactly is he going to save us? I think the human race has gone waay too far right now to change.

What confuses me about Jesus dying for our sins is not the free will part but...ok, Jesus is part God (holy trinity and all that), so he didn't have to die to save us God could have just forgiven us if he wanted to, he didn't have to send his son to earth to be tortured for the sake of humanity. He's suppose to be the all powerful God, he made the world, he can do what he wants, so...why not just forgive us without the big crucifixion ?

oOoOo I learned something on this. I read somewhere in the Bible. God wanted us to see what a great sacrifice he gave us. Like "I love you so much Im gonna send my only son to die for you guys." Its like if God sent a talking sheep to preform his word, people would kill the sheep and then eat it :/

Sheepo@_@:

Incubus:

Nine_Inch_Nails:

And Jesus also said he died for us...

To save mankind.

If he was going to "save" us, doesn't that affect out free will? And how exactly is he going to save us? I think the human race has gone waay too far right now to change.

What confuses me about Jesus dying for our sins is not the free will part but...ok, Jesus is part God (holy trinity and all that), so he didn't have to die to save us God could have just forgiven us if he wanted to, he didn't have to send his son to earth to be tortured for the sake of humanity. He's suppose to be the all powerful God, he made the world, he can do what he wants, so...why not just forgive us without the big crucifixion ?

oOoOo I learned something on this. I read somewhere in the Bible. God wanted us to see what a great sacrifice he gave us. Like "I love you so much Im gonna send my only son to die for you guys." Its like if God sent a talking sheep to preform his word, people would kill the sheep and then eat it :/

He wanted to show his love for us by sacrificing his own son

fender:

For argument's sake, lets just say there is a God, for certain. If God is evil, why would he create us, and give us a beautiful earth to inhabit, and the greatest gift of all, Life?.


ok maybe he gave us a nice beautiful earth because he knew that in the end we would destroy it and die a long and horrible death in all the fumes of the horrible technogical shit WE made.

That's pointless. Why would he go to all the trouble of creating it, if his ulterior motive was to watch it fall?. I'd like to concentrate on the 'WE' part of your post. You've just rather shot yourself in the foot there.

Exactly. 'We' are the ones poisoning the earth, not God.