The War Against Christmas

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John Entwistle
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John Entwistle
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December 4th, 2007 at 02:12am
Well, from my experience on GSB, almost none of you know that Christians celebrate Jesus' birthday on Christmas. He may have not technically been born on the 25th of December, but that is what us Christian celebrate Christmas for.

History of Christmas: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christmas
http://www.history.com/minisites/christmas/viewPage?pageId=1252

If you watch the news you will know that people are complaining about nativity sets (figures of Jesus, Mary, Joseph and the three wise men in the manger) in public places. People want them gone, but if it was a menorot people wouldn't care.

Here's an article about it: http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,314383,00.html

I am think that people from a hundred years ago or longer, celebrated Christmas because of Christ's birth. But then people stopped believing, however they still celebrated it because, well it's Christmas. Now they celebrate it without Christ. In someways I think that if you are not celebrating Christmas because of Jesus' birth than you shouldn't be celebrating it at all. Snooty

Shifty

So, what do you guys think about it?
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December 4th, 2007 at 04:48am
Personally, I go to Church Christmas Eve, and my family says grace before eating and such. We do acknowledge Jesus and religion, etc.

But I don't mind people who don't celebrate it for religious reasons. I remember as a child, having no idea about religion and Jesus, and some of my favorites things were preparing for Santa, trimming the tree, hanging stockings and whatnot. It's become a part of American culture, and I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing.
girl almighty
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December 4th, 2007 at 10:21am
Being non-religious myself, I was always raised to celebrate christmas as a special time of year rather than a Christian celebration. I know the story of the nativity etc., but I don't believe in God. I remember being forced to say prayers to and sing hymns praising a God I didn't believe in when I was in primary school.
In parts of London, the lights decorating the streets aren't allowed to be called "Christmas lights" because people believe it to be discriminatory against those who aren't Christian - this is particularly around areas like Tower Hamlets where the majority of the population is Muslim. As with taking away images of the nativity, I'm not sure where I stand on this tbh.
I like the feeling December the 25th brings to people; the shoppers and the kids generally look much happier, even if everything's a bit manic. Like Mary said, Christmas as a holiday is part of western culture, and I love the atmosphere it brings.
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December 4th, 2007 at 11:58am
That time of year was picked as it co-inced with the Winter Solitice. Just like Easter for the Spring Pagan festivals. They used these dates to help conversion rates with all the heathen.

I don't like how Christmas has gone all commerical. I used to hate the word 'Xmas' but I found that it actually has a point as the Greek letter 'X' means 'Chi' so...you get the idea.
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December 4th, 2007 at 12:10pm
Well my mum told me when I was young that Santa doesn't exist and that she brings us presents so I never believed in the whole Santa thing, but she also said that little Jesus brings us presents, such being represented in love and joy and so on.

Since by time I became less and less religious I celebrate Christmas as a time of year that should be happy for everyone and when we should try harder than usual to make it good for those less fortunate. I think its a time of year when you are allowed to sing no matter how bad you are at it, when you can eat tons of sweets and cakes and cookies without feeling guilty, when you can make snowmen and have snow wars no matter how old you are, when you can enjoy the beautiful lights in the town and snow if you have any, when you can make your friends and family happy with simple presents, when you can snuggle with your loved one and drink hot cocoa and forget about your worries. Its when everyone joins in peace and harmony and tries to make things better.


I think God and Jesus would be pleased with that. Con
John Entwistle
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December 4th, 2007 at 04:31pm
east infection.:
Well my mum told me when I was young that Santa doesn't exist and that she brings us presents so I never believed in the whole Santa thing, but she also said that little Jesus brings us presents, such being represented in love and joy and so on.

Since by time I became less and less religious I celebrate Christmas as a time of year that should be happy for everyone and when we should try harder than usual to make it good for those less fortunate. I think its a time of year when you are allowed to sing no matter how bad you are at it, when you can eat tons of sweets and cakes and cookies without feeling guilty, when you can make snowmen and have snow wars no matter how old you are, when you can enjoy the beautiful lights in the town and snow if you have any, when you can make your friends and family happy with simple presents, when you can snuggle with your loved one and drink hot cocoa and forget about your worries. Its when everyone joins in peace and harmony and tries to make things better.


I think God and Jesus would be pleased with that. Con


Well, that is a good point.
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December 4th, 2007 at 08:15pm
I think that if you are not celebrating Christmas because of Jesus' birth than you shouldn't be celebrating it at all.

So, if you believe in jesus, then its ok to be materialistic and manipulate the holiday to get presents? Because I gurantee you, the majority of Christians who celebrate christmas don't mainly focus on Jesus being born. Shifty

Reguardless of religious origins, Christmas has a whole new meaning in modern society. it's main focus isn't about jesus being born, it's about other things. Family time, celebrations of other things, giving gifts, ect. That isn't really something bad is it? I think everyone has the right to do those things. True, maybe they shouldn't refer to it as "christmas" if they don't believe in what it represents, but Christmas is just a name, it isn't that signifigant.

As for the nativity scenes, no public place that recieves government funding has the right to display any religious items seeing as how the government (in most places at least) is secular. If the public library started displaying menorahs all over the place, I assure you some psycho Christians would freak out. However, if they displayed historical information about multiple holidays, that would be somethig totally different, so it would depend on the setting of the nativity scene.
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December 4th, 2007 at 08:40pm
I laugh all the time, christmas lights being taken down in case it offends other faiths. If they aren't happy with our ways, they go back to wherever they came from.
John Entwistle
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December 4th, 2007 at 08:52pm
schooldropout:
I laugh all the time, christmas lights being taken down in case it offends other faiths. If they aren't happy with our ways, they go back to wherever they came from.


I agree, but at the sometime sometimes those people aren't from other countries. They were born now, so...yeah

And now someone is going to give me some speech about it. Rolling Eyes

.
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December 4th, 2007 at 08:58pm
schooldropout:
christmas lights
What makes some lights Christmas and other lights non-christmas lights? lmfao they're freaking lights! Just seasonal decorations...
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December 4th, 2007 at 09:28pm
Kurtni:
What makes some lights Christmas and other lights non-christmas lights? lmfao they're freaking lights! Just seasonal decorations...
True. People who live round here keep theirs out all year, so really, Santa is partying all year round Cool

I've never been very religious, but then again, my family has never gone wild about Christmas. I don't think people should be 'restricted' from celebrating it, if it gets you together with family etc. to have a good time. I also don't really like the way it's become so commercialised...
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December 5th, 2007 at 02:13am
Actually, I have to agree, that whether or not you believe in Jesus or not, it's important to know why the holiday was created. Whether or not you celebrate it or not is your own business, but also know that people who do believe in Jesus often do celebrate the holiday for Him- not all, but some.
And ftr- I'm sick of people saying how commercial Christmas is. I don't care if it's true or not, since when is negativity the new black? Rolling Eyes
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December 5th, 2007 at 02:17am
Kurtni:
I think that if you are not celebrating Christmas because of Jesus' birth than you shouldn't be celebrating it at all.

So, if you believe in jesus, then its ok to be materialistic and manipulate the holiday to get presents? Because I gurantee you, the majority of Christians who celebrate christmas don't mainly focus on Jesus being born. Shifty

Reguardless of religious origins, Christmas has a whole new meaning in modern society. it's main focus isn't about jesus being born, it's about other things. Family time, celebrations of other things, giving gifts, ect. That isn't really something bad is it? I think everyone has the right to do those things. True, maybe they shouldn't refer to it as "christmas" if they don't believe in what it represents, but Christmas is just a name, it isn't that signifigant.

As for the nativity scenes, no public place that recieves government funding has the right to display any religious items seeing as how the government (in most places at least) is secular. If the public library started displaying menorahs all over the place, I assure you some psycho Christians would freak out. However, if they displayed historical information about multiple holidays, that would be somethig totally different, so it would depend on the setting of the nativity scene.

In a random comment, I'd like to point out that you miswrote her quote. Yes, you just left out 3 words, but still, those 3 words change the meaning quite a bit. By her saying "in some ways" she means that she isn't firmly rooted in that belief, but some of the things she thinks leads her to that options. It just seemed a tad misleading.
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December 5th, 2007 at 03:49pm
schooldropout:
I laugh all the time, christmas lights being taken down in case it offends other faiths. If they aren't happy with our ways, they go back to wherever they came from.


Seriously? People take down their Christmas lights? Cuz...we never bothered to check i anyone was offended with our rangolis or Diwali lights or little clay lamps or anything. But then again, it was a mostly Asian neighborhood in the middle of suburban New Jersey.

And that is an awful thing to say, "our ways". Who is "we"? Are you referring to Americans, Caucasians, or Christians? But in a way, you have a point. No one should come to a country and critisize religious customs, especially if they're given freedom to practice their own religious customs.
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December 5th, 2007 at 04:43pm
tbh, I forgot all the Jesus being born on Christmas and all that. In our family we either put up the tree or the Nativity set. I believe that Jesus and the Wise Men and all those other people (no offence, sorry) did exist, it's a fact. I mainly celebrate Christmas because it's the time where friends and family reunite and have a good peaceful time. I also celebrate it because it's the only time of the year, besides my birthday, where I can get something I can't get on my own money (like this new amp I want). I know that sounds a bit materialistic but I just guess that it's a wordwide traditon.

I think I expressed myself clearly Coolio
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December 5th, 2007 at 08:10pm
Santa:

In a random comment, I'd like to point out that you miswrote her quote. Yes, you just left out 3 words, but still, those 3 words change the meaning quite a bit. By her saying "in some ways" she means that she isn't firmly rooted in that belief, but some of the things she thinks leads her to that options. It just seemed a tad misleading.

I didn't quote her name because I wasn't refering to her in particular, but more or less the people who hold that belief, because alot of people do. I should have specified that, sorry. Con
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December 5th, 2007 at 08:39pm
lyrical_mess:
schooldropout:
I laugh all the time, christmas lights being taken down in case it offends other faiths. If they aren't happy with our ways, they go back to wherever they came from.


Seriously? People take down their Christmas lights? Cuz...we never bothered to check i anyone was offended with our rangolis or Diwali lights or little clay lamps or anything. But then again, it was a mostly Asian neighborhood in the middle of suburban New Jersey.

And that is an awful thing to say, "our ways". Who is "we"? Are you referring to Americans, Caucasians, or Christians? But in a way, you have a point. No one should come to a country and critisize religious customs, especially if they're given freedom to practice their own religious customs.

But when you use the term "Americans" you have to remember that America wasn't founded on any particular religion, the constitution never even uses the word "God" once, it's totally secular. I (sarcastically) love how hypocritical some Americans are, they enjoy the fact that we're free, then they turn around and bitch about other people having the same freedoms. You have the right to put up Christmas lights, other people have the right to be offended .that's how it works. They have the right to express why they're offended, and you have the right to not care lmfao Everyone is given freedom of speech, and just because someone doesn't like what they say doesn't mean they should leave the country like schooldropout said.

One of the reasons I love my country so much is that fact that so many different cultures can coexist peacefully. Obviously, we're not perfect, and conflicts to arise sometimes, but it's still neat where it does exist. Then, Christmas comes around and all hell breaks loose Orvil
People discriminate and judge, and tell people to "go back to where they came from" just because they celebrate Kwanzaa or Hannukah. What they don't realize is this is where they came from. America obviously has a large Christian population, but other religions have been around for a long time as well, and they have just as much right to be here as anyone else.This thread is called the war on Christmas; I think the war against all celebrations deserves to be acknowledged.

btw Sruti, half of that post had nothing to do with what you even said. I just needed to rant. And Now I feel better Shifty
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December 5th, 2007 at 10:20pm
why can't people leave some things alone like christmas..i time honored tradition..no harm in lights, santa, christmas songs, and presents. its a time to feel great so i think we should just let it be!!!
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December 5th, 2007 at 10:22pm
Kurtni:
Santa:

In a random comment, I'd like to point out that you miswrote her quote. Yes, you just left out 3 words, but still, those 3 words change the meaning quite a bit. By her saying "in some ways" she means that she isn't firmly rooted in that belief, but some of the things she thinks leads her to that options. It just seemed a tad misleading.

I didn't quote her name because I wasn't refering to her in particular, but more or less the people who hold that belief, because alot of people do. I should have specified that, sorry. Con

ahh I understand. Sorry for ze confusion :]
John Entwistle
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December 5th, 2007 at 10:26pm
Santa:
Kurtni:
I think that if you are not celebrating Christmas because of Jesus' birth than you shouldn't be celebrating it at all.

So, if you believe in jesus, then its ok to be materialistic and manipulate the holiday to get presents? Because I gurantee you, the majority of Christians who celebrate christmas don't mainly focus on Jesus being born. Shifty

Reguardless of religious origins, Christmas has a whole new meaning in modern society. it's main focus isn't about jesus being born, it's about other things. Family time, celebrations of other things, giving gifts, ect. That isn't really something bad is it? I think everyone has the right to do those things. True, maybe they shouldn't refer to it as "christmas" if they don't believe in what it represents, but Christmas is just a name, it isn't that signifigant.

As for the nativity scenes, no public place that recieves government funding has the right to display any religious items seeing as how the government (in most places at least) is secular. If the public library started displaying menorahs all over the place, I assure you some psycho Christians would freak out. However, if they displayed historical information about multiple holidays, that would be somethig totally different, so it would depend on the setting of the nativity scene.

In a random comment, I'd like to point out that you miswrote her quote. Yes, you just left out 3 words, but still, those 3 words change the meaning quite a bit. By her saying "in some ways" she means that she isn't firmly rooted in that belief, but some of the things she thinks leads her to that options. It just seemed a tad misleading.


Thank you for pointing that out.

I'm starting to think that if you celebrate Christmas, and don't include Christ's birth, then whatever. Like you said it brings families together and that is important. But I still don't necessarily agree with it. I was raised a Catholic and I wanted to Catholic school for 12 years, so that's why I care so much. Plus, I don't want people to forget how Christmas started.
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