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Lucifers Angel
King For A Couple Of Days
Age: -
Gender: Female
Posts: 4751 | May 11th, 2007 at 05:14am druscilla; in rags:Bloodraine:If men don't have a right to decide what a women does to her uterus, then no woman has a right to demand child support. 
I disagree. Unless the woman said she would get an abortion and then doesn't or something.
My mother had three children with my dad and then they divorced because he was abusive.
She couldn't financially care for three children on her own.
Was she wrong to request child support?
Was she wrong to tell my dad he had no say if she aborted a child she thought she was carrying?
No. She had every right.
Once that baby is born there are two people who are responsible for it.
But the decision to allow the fetus to turn into the child is the mother's.
A fetus and a child are different. The child has rights; the fetus doesn't.
well for a lot of people the fetus does have rights, and there are two people responsible for a pregnant woman, she would soon cry out to the man if she needed somthing for the baby or herself during the pregnancy. when would "you" call the fetus a child? when it is born? or when it can be born and live? which is normally around the 6th or 7th month of prenancy? here is what i found about a babys heart.
Week 5: Baby's heart begins to beat
Your baby at week 5 (three weeks from conception)
At week five, your baby is 1/17 of an inch long — about the size of the tip of a pen.
This week, your baby's heart and circulatory system are taking shape. Your baby's blood vessels will complete a circuit, and his or her heart will begin to beat. Although you won't be able to hear it yet, the motion of your baby's beating heart may be detected with an ultrasound exam.
With these changes, circulation begins — making the circulatory system the first functioning organ system.
------------------------------------------------
at week five of pregnancy the bays heart starts to beat, are you saying that a baby/fetus with a heart shoudl be aborted?
and the case of your mum is so differant unless she told you dad she was going to get an abortion. |
Brendon Urie..
King For A Couple Of Days
Age: 37
Gender: Female
Posts: 2394
 | May 11th, 2007 at 12:48pm ^
I'm saying that legally a fetus does not have rights.
It is a being living within the mother and does not have rights.
You cannot have rights until you are born and legally become a person.
No, I do not agree with late-term abortions, but that does not make the fetus a legal person.
You cannot be a person until you aren't living within a host. |
Matt Smith
Admin
Age: 33
Gender: Female
Posts: 31134
 | May 11th, 2007 at 12:51pm druscilla; in rags:Bloodraine:If men don't have a right to decide what a women does to her uterus, then no woman has a right to demand child support.
I disagree. Unless the woman said she would get an abortion and then doesn't or something.
My mother had three children with my dad and then they divorced because he was abusive.
She couldn't financially care for three children on her own.
Was she wrong to request child support?
Was she wrong to tell my dad he had no say if she aborted a child she thought she was carrying?
No. She had every right.
Once that baby is born there are two people who are responsible for it.
But the decision to allow the fetus to turn into the child is the mother's.
A fetus and a child are different. The child has rights; the fetus doesn't.
You can't have your cake and eat it.
Women aren't something special, they don't deserve to abuse men in that way. Its like, hello, we have a right to his sperm, his money, and right to kill his child/foetus/changeling/zygote/whateverbuzzword. He has no rights; none, except he has to pay £x every month towards some baby/foetus/changeling/zygote that he has no rights over.
I mean, jesus. Give the girl a uterus and they think they're gods gift. |
Dom
Jackass
Age: 35
Gender: Male
Posts: 1691 | May 11th, 2007 at 01:29pm Bloodraine:druscilla; in rags:Bloodraine:If men don't have a right to decide what a women does to her uterus, then no woman has a right to demand child support.
I disagree. Unless the woman said she would get an abortion and then doesn't or something.
My mother had three children with my dad and then they divorced because he was abusive.
She couldn't financially care for three children on her own.
Was she wrong to request child support?
Was she wrong to tell my dad he had no say if she aborted a child she thought she was carrying?
No. She had every right.
Once that baby is born there are two people who are responsible for it.
But the decision to allow the fetus to turn into the child is the mother's.
A fetus and a child are different. The child has rights; the fetus doesn't.
You can't have your cake and eat it.
Women aren't something special, they don't deserve to abuse men in that way. Its like, hello, we have a right to his sperm, his money, and right to kill his child/foetus/changeling/zygote/whateverbuzzword. He has no rights; none, except he has to pay £x every month towards some baby/foetus/changeling/zygote that he has no rights over.
I mean, jesus. Give the girl a uterus and they think they're gods gift.
mm women can often use an unwanted pregnancy as some sort of blackmail against the man i guess. The decisions are very much in the mothers hands. |
Brendon Urie..
King For A Couple Of Days
Age: 37
Gender: Female
Posts: 2394
| May 11th, 2007 at 01:59pm Bloodraine:He has no rights; none, except he has to pay £x every month towards some baby/foetus/changeling/zygote that he has no rights over.
Okay, I don't know how things work in England, but over here in America that's not how it works.
The man has rights to his child once it's born unless he is ruled as an unfit parent. He has visitation even if he doesn't marry the mother. They share the fucking kid, all right?
I'm not saying she should take his money and then shove him off the face of the planet.
The only time when a man should have to pay child support and shouldn't have right to his child is if he is abusive or something. |
Anji
Basket Case
Age: 35
Gender: Female
Posts: 15914
| May 11th, 2007 at 04:07pm Ol' Blue Eyes.: Yes, the father's feeling should be considered, but he does not have to go through the pregnancy. There are some fathers who do strangely exhibit signs of pregnancy whilst their partner is pregnent. These men will have morning sickness, swollen bellies, even swollen 'man breasts', back aches, they'll be tiresome, emotional, everything. This is mostly found in cases of extremely devoted father, not to say that a father who does not get this isn't devoted, but it shows that some men do have to go through pregnancy with out even carrying a baby. I'd say that that's worse than the real thing. I mean, nine months of being pregnant even when you don't have a uterus.
My point, other that to give you something very odd indeed to think about, is just to show that pregnancy is just as big of an ordeal for fathers as it is for mothers and seeing as the child is half theirs, they have every right to have a say in the case of an abortion.
What else was I going to say? 
Oh yeah.
Pregnancy is one of the most important periods of a child's 'upbringing'. Many things that happen during pregnancy easily affect the rest of a child's life. |
rollerpig
GSBitch
Age: 33
Gender: Female
Posts: 62283 | May 11th, 2007 at 04:10pm ...I think women should have the choice. ._. |
grouchguitarist
Shoot Me, I'm A Newbie
Age: 33
Gender: Female
Posts: 3 | May 11th, 2007 at 11:42pm It is a womens choice what happens to her body. Whether she has sex, whether she does it protected.. And if she does end up pregnant, whether she has an abortion. The male in the relationship has an opinion but in the end he cant stop the women physically from having the abortion. Because what he says and what he does are completely different things. Its the same in many relationships, the male may say 9 months before the birth of the child that he will be there every step of the way, but when it actually comes to the birth his mind may of changed and by then its too late to have an abortion. No offence to males but they seem to think its easy to keep your life after you have a child to manage. Wait till they actually have a child growing inside of them then tell them they have the right to decide whether or not to have an abortion. |
Brendon Urie..
King For A Couple Of Days
Age: 37
Gender: Female
Posts: 2394
| May 12th, 2007 at 01:54am Anji:Ol' Blue Eyes.: Yes, the father's feeling should be considered, but he does not have to go through the pregnancy. There are some fathers who do strangely exhibit signs of pregnancy whilst their partner is pregnent. These men will have morning sickness, swollen bellies, even swollen 'man breasts', back aches, they'll be tiresome, emotional, everything. This is mostly found in cases of extremely devoted father, not to say that a father who does not get this isn't devoted, but it shows that some men do have to go through pregnancy with out even carrying a baby. I'd say that that's worse than the real thing. I mean, nine months of being pregnant even when you don't have a uterus.
So... a woman should be forced to give up her rights because the father might have sympathetic pregnancy. |
Brendon Urie..
King For A Couple Of Days
Age: 37
Gender: Female
Posts: 2394
| May 12th, 2007 at 01:54am grouchguitarist:It is a womens choice what happens to her body. Whether she has sex, whether she does it protected..
Wrong.
The father has the choice of whether or not to wear the condom. |
Sara.
This Board Is My Home
Age: -
Gender: -
Posts: 31155 | May 12th, 2007 at 02:39am druscilla; in rags:The father has the choice of whether or not to wear the condom. and the women has the choice to keep her legs shut or not. |
Matt Smith
Admin
Age: 33
Gender: Female
Posts: 31134
| May 12th, 2007 at 05:02am druscilla; in rags:Bloodraine:He has no rights; none, except he has to pay £x every month towards some baby/foetus/changeling/zygote that he has no rights over.
Okay, I don't know how things work in England, but over here in America that's not how it works.
The man has rights to his child once it's born unless he is ruled as an unfit parent. He has visitation even if he doesn't marry the mother. They share the fucking kid, all right?
I'm not saying she should take his money and then shove him off the face of the planet.
The only time when a man should have to pay child support and shouldn't have right to his child is if he is abusive or something.
Oh no.
Here, a man has to go to court before he can even be granted access to see a child, even if he's like, the ideal father. If the mother doesn't want him to see the kid, he has to go to court. No rights. Kind of like foetuses.
And if you're a non-resident parent (ex-partner or whatever), no matter how great of a guy you are, the mother has the right to your money. Unless you're really, really poor.
You can see here.
QuoteWhat is child maintenance?
Child maintenance is paid for children who live away from one or both of their parents. It is an amount of money paid regularly by the non-resident parent for the child. |
Lucifers Angel
King For A Couple Of Days
Age: -
Gender: Female
Posts: 4751 | May 12th, 2007 at 08:49am Bloodraine:druscilla; in rags:Bloodraine:He has no rights; none, except he has to pay £x every month towards some baby/foetus/changeling/zygote that he has no rights over.
Okay, I don't know how things work in England, but over here in America that's not how it works.
The man has rights to his child once it's born unless he is ruled as an unfit parent. He has visitation even if he doesn't marry the mother. They share the fucking kid, all right?
I'm not saying she should take his money and then shove him off the face of the planet.
The only time when a man should have to pay child support and shouldn't have right to his child is if he is abusive or something.
Oh no.
Here, a man has to go to court before he can even be granted access to see a child, even if he's like, the ideal father. If the mother doesn't want him to see the kid, he has to go to court. No rights. Kind of like foetuses.
And if you're a non-resident parent (ex-partner or whatever), no matter how great of a guy you are, the mother has the right to your money. Unless you're really, really poor.
You can see here.
QuoteWhat is child maintenance?
Child maintenance is paid for children who live away from one or both of their parents. It is an amount of money paid regularly by the non-resident parent for the child.
i knwo from expierience that child maintenance can also be deducted out of your benifits, me and husband split up for a short time and when they applied to take money out of his wages they wanted more than his wages actually were.
i also think that if the woman will not let the dad see the children or have any kind of access then she has no right to his money. I know girls who have gone out and got pregnant just so that they can claim money from the goverment and the fathers, and i knwo this to be fact because they told me themselfs that is what they were doing. |
PentatonicA
Shoot Me, I'm A Newbie
Age: -
Gender: -
Posts: 85 | May 12th, 2007 at 10:47pm |
Anji
Basket Case
Age: 35
Gender: Female
Posts: 15914
| May 13th, 2007 at 01:12pm Ballroom Blitz:druscilla; in rags:The father has the choice of whether or not to wear the condom. and the women has the choice to keep her legs shut or not. A condom isn't the only method of contraception anyway. Female condoms, diaphragms, birth control, even morning afters, spermicide, film, and soooooo much more are methods that are designed especially for women during sex. Infact, they get more choice than men do when it comes to birth control methods. |
Anji
Basket Case
Age: 35
Gender: Female
Posts: 15914
| May 13th, 2007 at 01:14pm druscilla; in rags:Anji:Ol' Blue Eyes.: Yes, the father's feeling should be considered, but he does not have to go through the pregnancy. There are some fathers who do strangely exhibit signs of pregnancy whilst their partner is pregnent. These men will have morning sickness, swollen bellies, even swollen 'man breasts', back aches, they'll be tiresome, emotional, everything. This is mostly found in cases of extremely devoted father, not to say that a father who does not get this isn't devoted, but it shows that some men do have to go through pregnancy with out even carrying a baby. I'd say that that's worse than the real thing. I mean, nine months of being pregnant even when you don't have a uterus.
So... a woman should be forced to give up her rights because the father might have sympathetic pregnancy. Oh yeah, you read in between the lines impecably! That's exactly what I was saying.  |
Misanthropist
Post Whore
Age: 32
Gender: Female
Posts: 23279 | May 13th, 2007 at 07:51pm Lucifers Angel:
i knwo from expierience that child maintenance can also be deducted out of your benifits, me and husband split up for a short time and when they applied to take money out of his wages they wanted more than his wages actually were.
i also think that if the woman will not let the dad see the children or have any kind of access then she has no right to his money. I know girls who have gone out and got pregnant just so that they can claim money from the goverment and the fathers, and i knwo this to be fact because they told me themselfs that is what they were doing.
Well. I think that's a tad unfair. Because in some cases it's the children not wanting to see the parent, or it's unhealthy for the parent to have "access" to the children. I still think that the parent should pay child support. |
Lucifers Angel
King For A Couple Of Days
Age: -
Gender: Female
Posts: 4751 | May 14th, 2007 at 03:40pm Misanthropist:Lucifers Angel:
i knwo from expierience that child maintenance can also be deducted out of your benifits, me and husband split up for a short time and when they applied to take money out of his wages they wanted more than his wages actually were.
i also think that if the woman will not let the dad see the children or have any kind of access then she has no right to his money. I know girls who have gone out and got pregnant just so that they can claim money from the goverment and the fathers, and i knwo this to be fact because they told me themselfs that is what they were doing.
Well. I think that's a tad unfair. Because in some cases it's the children not wanting to see the parent, or it's unhealthy for the parent to have "access" to the children. I still think that the parent should pay child support.
why should he? she wont give him access to the child, ok if he beat her up and bad nasty things to her i can understand but if she out right says "no you cant see you child/ren " because she wants to use the child has a pawn then she ahs no right to his money |
Misanthropist
Post Whore
Age: 32
Gender: Female
Posts: 23279 | May 14th, 2007 at 06:13pm Lucifers Angel:
why should he? she wont give him access to the child, ok if he beat her up and bad nasty things to her i can understand but if she out right says "no you cant see you child/ren " because she wants to use the child has a pawn then she ahs no right to his money
Well if there is no well founded reason for the mother/father to forbid their partner for seeing their children, then can't that be taken to court?
In lots of cases the parent isn't allowed to see their children for a reason, and I still think they should support their children with money., |
Brendon Urie..
King For A Couple Of Days
Age: 37
Gender: Female
Posts: 2394
| May 15th, 2007 at 12:01am Misanthropist:Lucifers Angel:
why should he? she wont give him access to the child, ok if he beat her up and bad nasty things to her i can understand but if she out right says "no you cant see you child/ren " because she wants to use the child has a pawn then she ahs no right to his money
Well if there is no well founded reason for the mother/father to forbid their partner for seeing their children, then can't that be taken to court?
Yes, it can be.
You can't legally keep your child from their other parent unless the court has given you permission.
It's called custody. |
