[Insert abortion here]

druscilla; in rags:

Misanthropist:

Lucifers Angel:

why should he? she wont give him access to the child, ok if he beat her up and bad nasty things to her i can understand but if she out right says "no you cant see you child/ren " because she wants to use the child has a pawn then she ahs no right to his money

Well if there is no well founded reason for the mother/father to forbid their partner for seeing their children, then can't that be taken to court?

Yes, it can be.
You can't legally keep your child from their other parent unless the court has given you permission.
It's called custody.

well actually you are right...but.....many mothers do not let they're partners see the children and even with court aid for the father he still deostn get to see them..... for example......the mum could call her ex and say so and so doesnt want to see you today....when in reality that child is sitting outside the house on a wall waiting for her dad to arrive....and when he doesnt she is told by the mum that "sorry but your dad just called and he cant make it today" those are the perents that should not cry out for maintenance miney.

Just a little music video for you all to watch:

(If you're too lazy to watch it, watch the first 3 minutes, then skip to about 6 and a half and watch it from there)

What do you think about it? Is it too far?
For me, personally, when she's walking with the umbilical cord... -shivers- That done it for me.
(On the other hand, the music is pretty good (If you like that type of thing))

I think the woman should have the choice, depending on whether the father is involved or not.

if they have been raped or are very young, i think they should be allowed to have an abortion, but if they just dont want a child, because they dont feel its the right time or whatever, they shouldnt.

"god knew you before you were formed in the womb"

god knew you were going to be conceived, before you even were.
this means you shouldnt have an abortion because God wanted the child ot happen. I dont agree, however, as God wouldnt want you to be raped or be too young to manage with a child.

so yep.

thats what i think.

Rhiannan---x:

I think the woman should have the choice, depending on whether the father is involved or not.

if they have been raped or are very young, i think they should be allowed to have an abortion, but if they just dont want a child, because they dont feel its the right time or whatever, they shouldnt.

"god knew you before you were formed in the womb"

god knew you were going to be conceived, before you even were.
this means you shouldnt have an abortion because God wanted the child ot happen. I dont agree, however, as God wouldnt want you to be raped or be too young to manage with a child.

so yep.

thats what i think.

That only applies if you believe in a god. Should an atheist be denied the decision to have an abortion because a Christian doesn't think it's morally right?

Ol' Blue Eyes.:

That only applies if you believe in a god. Should an atheist be denied the decision to have an abortion because a Christian doesn't think it's morally right?

Christian morals aren't the only ones opposed to abortion. Hell, Satanist morals are opposed to abortion because they hold children with such high reguards. Thats at the other end of the spectrum. I don't have any religious beliefs and Im opposed to it because I don't think humans have the right to end other lives out of their own selfish greed.

Kurtni:

Ol' Blue Eyes.:

That only applies if you believe in a god. Should an atheist be denied the decision to have an abortion because a Christian doesn't think it's morally right?

Christian morals aren't the only ones opposed to abortion. Hell, Satanist morals are opposed to abortion because they hold children with such high reguards. Thats at the other end of the spectrum. I don't have any religious beliefs and Im opposed to it because I don't think humans have the right to end other lives out of their own selfish greed.

I understand that, but she said that because of what her religion dictates, that women should be denied abortion. I know Christians aren't the only ones opposing it, just as there are Christians who support it.

I'm not sure if I've mentioned this before, maybe it was another thread....*shrug* Anyways.

I think it should be the mother's choice because there are exceptions to anything. I personally would have an extremely hard time going through with something like that, even if it was rape. But some women just aren't ready for something like that if it was rape and it needs to be done. If a law was passed to make it ILLEGAL, those women would completely be traumatized. Think about it...every time the mother saw the child...she'd remember it. When he grows older, he'll ask about a father. What is she supposed to say??

But then again, there are people that could take advantage of the law of choice. I mean, there are some girls out there who have unprotected sex, and just blow it off because they figure they can just abort the child if a child does happen to be conceived.

I think it's just one of those topics that will always have debate.

Ol' Blue Eyes.:

Kurtni:

Ol' Blue Eyes.:

That only applies if you believe in a god. Should an atheist be denied the decision to have an abortion because a Christian doesn't think it's morally right?

Christian morals aren't the only ones opposed to abortion. Hell, Satanist morals are opposed to abortion because they hold children with such high reguards. Thats at the other end of the spectrum. I don't have any religious beliefs and Im opposed to it because I don't think humans have the right to end other lives out of their own selfish greed.

I understand that, but she said that because of what her religion dictates, that women should be denied abortion. I know Christians aren't the only ones opposing it, just as there are Christians who support it.

no no.

im not christian.
at all.

i was simply quoting what some Christians believe.

Rhiannan---x:

Ol' Blue Eyes.:

Kurtni:

Ol' Blue Eyes.:

That only applies if you believe in a god. Should an atheist be denied the decision to have an abortion because a Christian doesn't think it's morally right?

Christian morals aren't the only ones opposed to abortion. Hell, Satanist morals are opposed to abortion because they hold children with such high reguards. Thats at the other end of the spectrum. I don't have any religious beliefs and Im opposed to it because I don't think humans have the right to end other lives out of their own selfish greed.

I understand that, but she said that because of what her religion dictates, that women should be denied abortion. I know Christians aren't the only ones opposing it, just as there are Christians who support it.

no no.

im not christian.
at all.

i was simply quoting what some Christians believe.

Christians was just an example dear, sorry.

But I don't agree with your stance. How can you deny others a decision, simply because your own personal beliefs don't support it?

Ol' Blue Eyes.:

But I don't agree with your stance. How can you deny others a decision, simply because your own personal beliefs don't support it?

How can the law deny rapists to rape, simply because the lawmaker's own personal beliefs don't support it?

Chyeah. Sweeping statements= easily exploitable.

A friend of mine got pregnant for the third or fourth time. She's aborted them all. Ofcourse, that's irresponsible and stupid. But she never planned to get pregnant.
Last time she got pregnant, she said she wanted to keep the baby and she was going to make me godmother. I was very happy for her, but next day she had doubts and she aborted short time after. That was the first time an abortion of hers had touched me like that, because you know, that was my to-be godchild. But it wasn't right for her; she's fifteen; she doesn't go to a proper school; she's struggling very hard; she's had a rough life and to be honest, she shouldn't have to carry a baby in her stomach for 9 months, being called a slut and irresponsible when she's already got more shit than most when she can't handle it.

If you want to be sure not to be unplannedly pregnant or getting STIs or STDs, use a condom. It's irresponsible to get pregnant, when you can't handle a baby. Think it over first. But sometimes condoms break and you have no choice but to have an abortion because you simply aren't ready. Other times you abort without any help and that's a shame as well, if you really want that baby. One way or another, abortions are never fun.

Bloodraine:

Ol' Blue Eyes.:

But I don't agree with your stance. How can you deny others a decision, simply because your own personal beliefs don't support it?

How can the law deny rapists to rape, simply because the lawmaker's own personal beliefs don't support it?

Chyeah. Sweeping statements= easily exploitable.

I'll rephrase that. "How can you deny a group of women the right to an abortion, just because you would never get one yourself?"

as a point other than the morality of abortion. Theres evidence to suggest that after abortion was legalised in america, the crime rates there have dropped dramatically, because the majority of abortions that took place were from low income families, who were more likely to commit crime. But because these people were being aborted they werent around to commit the crimes. Deciding to make abortion illegal could cause crime rates to soar, and women will just get dangerous back street abortions, which is dangerous to both child and mother.

dunno if this has been said, but im not reading 61 pages.

Dom:

as a point other than the morality of abortion. Theres evidence to suggest that after abortion was legalised in america, the crime rates there have dropped dramatically, because the majority of abortions that took place were from low income families, who were more likely to commit crime. But because these people were being aborted they werent around to commit the crimes. Deciding to make abortion illegal could cause crime rates to soar, and women will just get dangerous back street abortions, which is dangerous to both child and mother.

dunno if this has been said, but im not reading 61 pages.

Please explain your logic to me as to how being poor makes you a criminal?

Kurtni:

Dom:

as a point other than the morality of abortion. Theres evidence to suggest that after abortion was legalised in america, the crime rates there have dropped dramatically, because the majority of abortions that took place were from low income families, who were more likely to commit crime. But because these people were being aborted they werent around to commit the crimes. Deciding to make abortion illegal could cause crime rates to soar, and women will just get dangerous back street abortions, which is dangerous to both child and mother.

dunno if this has been said, but im not reading 61 pages.

Please explain your logic to me as to how being poor makes you a criminal?

Statistics.
And not everyone who is poor is a criminal.
It's just statistics.

druscilla; in rags:

Kurtni:

Dom:

as a point other than the morality of abortion. Theres evidence to suggest that after abortion was legalised in america, the crime rates there have dropped dramatically, because the majority of abortions that took place were from low income families, who were more likely to commit crime. But because these people were being aborted they werent around to commit the crimes. Deciding to make abortion illegal could cause crime rates to soar, and women will just get dangerous back street abortions, which is dangerous to both child and mother.

dunno if this has been said, but im not reading 61 pages.

Please explain your logic to me as to how being poor makes you a criminal?

Statistics.
And not everyone who is poor is a criminal.
It's just statistics.

im not saying being poor makes you a criminal. Im saying, statistically criminals are more likely to be from a deprived background, it doesnt take a genius to work that out. Also, those from poorer backgrounds are more likely to have an abortion. Its not my opinion, its just what the figures show. Its not my personal view on abortion.

I've been talking to my friends and family about abortion and abortion laws (the latter I am not so familiar with) and all of them (that's right, all) were "pro-choice". When asked to delegate their opinions further, most of them used the only logic of: What a woman does with her body is her business. Being forced to carry a baby to term is a violation of her body.
or: a fetus is not a person, therefor they do not have the right to life etc.

It all bothers me (even though everyone has a right to their own opinion). I mean, I guess i didn't realize how steadfast i was into this anti-abortion sort of thing until everyone I talked to was pro-choice. there are some people, my cousin for one, who i know for sure are against abortion. my cousin has never had an abortion and has been aware that getting pregnant wwas a possibility when she started to become sexual active. She wasn't ready when she got pregnant, she didn't have money, and she carried to term.
Of course every situation is different.

One fact I wanted to check up on, though. i was talking to my dad's girlfriend and she mentioned that she read in the paper that Canada has no laws against abortion and an abortion can be given at any time during pregnancy. I countered witht the fact that many hospitals have their own rules against that. i mean, some hospitals here won't even share the sex of the baby for fear of a gender-preferenced-induced abortion (i hope that made sense)

I've read about abortions and methods that are used when in the third trimester etc.
It is revolting.
So I was just wanting clarification on that little...uh..tidbit or whatever. This has probably been discussed before

The only time I think it would be at all ok is if rape was the cause of pregnancy, if she just had sex it's her fault and a life should not be taken because of her mistake.

Misanthropist:

I've read about abortions and methods that are used when in the third trimester etc.
It is revolting.
So I was just wanting clarification on that little...uh..tidbit or whatever. This has probably been discussed before

I don't support abortions in the third trimester unless it's a medical emergency or the like. I think a woman should know whether or not she wants to abort within the first trimester.